Was Nero Wolfe gay?

[Fire Tiger]

As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.

But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?

Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.

Scott

[Dorothy J Heydt]

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman.

No. Irene Adler (for that was her name) was an extremely
intelligent lady who had had a brief affaire with a Grand Duke,
and had kept in her possession a photograph that he wanted back,
now that he was at the point of making an important political
marriage. Holmes set a trap to make her reveal her hiding place
so that he could purloin the picture, but she was one jump ahead
of him and when Holmes found the hiding place, there was nothing
left in it but a letter addressed to him. "Dear Mr. Holmes," it
said in effect, "I've taken the picture and gone off to other
places with my new husband. Tell the Grand Duke he needn't
worry; I won't expose him."

This was, one of the very few times (four, I think) that anybody
successfully fooled Holmes, and it gained her his lasting admiration.
Love? That's a matter of semantics. She was probably the only woman
he ever respected. Thus far, the Holmes canon.

Then along came a fellow named William Baring-Gould who wrote,
among other books, two titles called _Sherlock Holmes of Baker
Street_ and _Nero Wolfe of West 35th Street_, in which he speculated
that Nero Wolfe might have been the wild oat of Holmes and Adler,
who had somehow met for a brief tryst in the wilds of Montenegro.
He makes it sound *somewhat* more plausible than I have done
here. Mind you, he *never* names Holmes's name, and the only
hint as to whom he's talking about (assuming a reader of
sufficient density) is the letter described below.

Anyway, Sherlock's lovechild strongly resembles brother Mycroft,
being just as smart and a lot more sedentary. Mycroft will
actually leave his den for matters of critical importance to the
State. Nero never *voluntarily* left his home for anything of
less importance than an important dinner, an orchid show, danger
to his own life, or World War Two.

Post by Fire Tiger
Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet?

No. However, he did send a letter to Baring-Gould, which is
reprinted at the end of the book. It read something like, "Dear
Mr. Baring-Gould: As the literary agent for [name of character],
I must decline either to affirm or to deny your speculations
regarding the early history of [name of character.] Sincerely
yours, Rex Stout."

Post by Fire Tiger
Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?

Well, you know, he's old. He would have been begotten sometime
in the 1890s, and when we meet him in _Fer-de-Lance_ in 1934 he'd
be already in his forties. And then he goes on for decade after
decade, officially not aging at all, nor does Archie, which I
consider a flaw in the Stout novels. Christie handled it better:
although both Poirot and Marple were elderly to begin with, they
did at least become more frail and eventually die. Wolfe is old
enough to know better than to be carried away with anything less
than a new species of orchid. And Archie ought to be.

In any case, Wolfe is clearly, from the time we first meet him,
a man who never lets his balls rule his brains.

Post by Fire Tiger
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.

I would say he's a brain-over-balls man and a misogynist: his
basic premise is that all women are fluffheads, and he seldom
gets close enough to one to find out different. There are a few
exceptions: all my Stouts are in storage so I can't look them up,
but there was the one who argued literary criticism with him (her
tagline was "I wish you well") and the one who taught him how to
make proper cawn beef haaaaaash. Basically, he respects
intelligent people and has met few female ones.

Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
***@kithrup.com

[Kat R]

Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I would say he's a brain-over-balls man and a misogynist: his
basic premise is that all women are fluffheads, and he seldom
gets close enough to one to find out different. There are a few
exceptions: all my Stouts are in storage so I can't look them up,
but there was the one who argued literary criticism with him (her
tagline was "I wish you well") and the one who taught him how to
make proper cawn beef haaaaaash. Basically, he respects
intelligent people and has met few female ones.

I always felt Wolfe simply didn't like people much regardless of gender.
Intelligence was the only thing that mattered to him and if he did't
see it in you or didn't see you excersizing what you had, he just
couldn't be bothered with you. To be homosexual, he'd have to actually
LIKE someone who happened to be male enough to let them into his
personal space. I don't think he even liked Fritz that much.

[Catherine Thompson]

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.
Scott

"The" woman was Irene Adler, and she was the only person ever to
completely outwit Holmes. He had to admire that. ;-)

Catherine

[Brian]

On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:45:04 -0700 (PDT), Fire Tiger

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.
Scott

It's been a long time since I've read the books but I seem to remember
that he was engaged and she died, I think killed in a war.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

Post by Brian
It's been a long time since I've read the books but I seem to remember
that he was engaged and she died, I think killed in a war.

I don't remember anything along those lines, and I think I've
read all the Wolves that are actually by stout.

He did have an adopted daughter (he adopted her as a child
because he could see her ribs sticking out); she got involved in
a Montenegrin independence movement which killed not only her but
Wolf's best friend, Marko Vukcic. Wolfe then took Archie to
Montenegro (then well behind the Iron Curtain so they had to
sneak) and managed so to bamboozle the murderer as to bring him
home to New York and get him arrested.

I really don't think Wolfe was *ever* engaged to be married.

Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
***@kithrup.com

[Wes Struebing]

On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:45:04 -0700 (PDT), Fire Tiger

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.

Somehow, I don't think so.

I haven't read a whole lot of Nero Wolfe, but the character in what I
have read (and the character in the TV specials) seems more
anti-social (not misogynist, but leaning that way...). That's all. He
doesn't seem to have a high opinion of most males, either.
--

Wes Struebing

Jan. 20, 2009 - the end of an error

[Cheryl P.]

Post by Brian
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:45:04 -0700 (PDT), Fire Tiger

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.

Somehow, I don't think so.
I haven't read a whole lot of Nero Wolfe, but the character in what I
have read (and the character in the TV specials) seems more
anti-social (not misogynist, but leaning that way...). That's all. He
doesn't seem to have a high opinion of most males, either.

I agree. And surely if he were gay, he wouldn't merely not date or marry
a woman, he'd have been more interested in men on a personal level, even
if he didn't date one of them due to none of them being sufficiently
intelligent or at least knowlegdeable about food and orchids.

Cheryl

[Dorothy J Heydt]

Post by Cheryl P.

Post by Brian
On Mon, 22 Sep 2008 08:45:04 -0700 (PDT), Fire Tiger

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.

Somehow, I don't think so.
I haven't read a whole lot of Nero Wolfe, but the character in what I
have read (and the character in the TV specials) seems more
anti-social (not misogynist, but leaning that way...). That's all. He
doesn't seem to have a high opinion of most males, either.

I agree. And surely if he were gay, he wouldn't merely not date or marry
a woman, he'd have been more interested in men on a personal level, even
if he didn't date one of them due to none of them being sufficiently
intelligent or at least knowlegdeable about food and orchids.

Well, a gay man in the 1930s, or 1940s, or 1950s ... might *want*
to date men; he might even (like Plato) think that only men were
intelligent to want to have a relationship with. But he would
find it rather difficult in that time period, *particularly for
someone who hardly ever left his own house.* He couldn't, or
rather, he demonstrably didn't, hang out on street corners
looking for cute young men. He'd have to canoodle with one of
his housemates -- Fritz? unlikely; Horstmann? unlikely; Archie,
that blatant heterosexual? no way in hell!

Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
***@kithrup.com

[Mark Alan Miller]

Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Well, a gay man in the 1930s, or 1940s, or 1950s ... might *want*
to date men; he might even (like Plato) think that only men were
intelligent to want to have a relationship with. But he would
find it rather difficult in that time period, *particularly for
someone who hardly ever left his own house.* He couldn't, or
rather, he demonstrably didn't, hang out on street corners
looking for cute young men. He'd have to canoodle with one of
his housemates -- Fritz? unlikely; Horstmann? unlikely; Archie,
that blatant heterosexual? no way in hell!

I never thought of him as gay (and I certainly would have considered the
possibility). Having a thing about Archie would be understandable, so maybe
the boss just kept his fantasies to himself. Or Archie just didn't write
about everything that went on. And Lily Rowan was a lesbian. Hmm.

Mark Alan Miller

[r***@gmail.com]

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.
Scott

Nero was a 350 pound middle aged agoraphobic recluse with utter disdain for the mundane "nit wits" of the human race. Writers don't always consider sexual preference when creating a fictional character. Not everyone thinks about that all the time so don't think to include it in their creations. Nero Wolfe's sexual polarity was never mentioned in any of the Rex Stout books, probably because Rex Stout never considered it important... or, probably, even considered it, at all. What there is is all there is and there ain't no more. Also, well, there ain't no "also." That's all I got.

[r***@gmail.com]

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.
Scott

Nero was a 350 pound middle aged agoraphobic recluse with utter disdain for the mundane "nit wits" of the human race. Artists and creaters-- even writers don't always consider sexual preferences when creating a fictional characters. Not everyone thinks about that all the time so don't think to include it in their creations. Nero Wolfe's sexual polarity was never mentioned in any of the Rex Stout books, probably because Rex Stout never considered it important... or, probably, even considered it, at all. What there is is all there is and there ain't no more. Also, well, there ain't no "also." That's all I got.

[s***@gmail.com]

Post by Fire Tiger
As I work my way through Rex Stout's Nero Wolfe novels (now reading
"And Be A Villain"), I wonder if Nero Wolfe was/is a homosexual. I
think I have at least read/listened/watched half of the Nero Wolfe
novels (35 of 70-ish) and, time and time again, Nero Wolfe seems to
hate women, never dates them, never married one, and only likes to be
around men. He did have an adopted daughter but that's about it.
But maybe the regulars here know differently. Maybe I just haven't
come across a Nero Wolfe tale that reveals another side of the fat
guy. Sherlock Holmes was sort of like this but Sir Arthur revealed in
one tale that Sherlock did once love a woman (referred to as "the"
woman) ... that, if my memory serves me right, she was a villainess
and whom he sent to the hangman. Did Rex reveal likewise in a Nero
tale but simply one I haven't read yet. Or did Nero leave such
animalistic instincts behind him in the old country and he was simply
now asexual?
Whether Nero was gay, asexual, or whatever won't affect my enjoyment
of the stories. I will still continue to read them and have as a goal
to read every single one of them. I am just wondering.
Scott

He was not. The author made it clear that Nero Wolfe disliked female behavior (defined according the usual stereotypes) but he liked women sexually. He was in fact madly in love once in his home country. His later lack of interest in sex and his substitution of sex with eating was vaguely connected to how that affair ended.